LEILA FADEL, HOST:
How far will the Trump administration take its campaign against speech the president doesn't like?
STEVE INSKEEP, HOST:
In a moment, we'll hear from a free speech lawyer. Here's what's happening. President Trump says that broadcasters allowing criticism of him should, quote, "maybe lose their license." The Federal Communications Commission licenses TV and radio stations. The FCC chairman, Brendan Carr, threatened retaliation against ABC stations this week. And ABC stopped the show of comedian Jimmy Kimmel over a monologue that related to the murder of Charlie Kirk. On Fox News last night, Carr promised more.
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BRENDAN CARR: I don't think this is the last shoe to drop. This is a massive shift that's taking place in the media ecosystem, and I think the consequences are going to continue to flow.
INSKEEP: The campaign against speech is a reversal for Republicans, including Carr, who wrote in 2019, quote, "the FCC does not have a roving mandate to police speech in the name of the public interest." Carr's words.
FADEL: NPR senior White House correspondent Tamara Keith has been following all this, and she joins me now. Good morning.
TAMARA KEITH, BYLINE: Good morning.
FADEL: OK, so can the FCC chair, Carr in this case, just pull broadcast licenses because the administration doesn't like a joke or criticism?
KEITH: The one Democratic member of the commission said Carr doesn't have the legal authority to do this, but that may not matter. The FCC has significant power to investigate and fine stations and, yes, even pull broadcast licenses. It also has jurisdiction over mergers and acquisitions, which has given Carr significant leverage. In Kimmel's case, two conglomerates that own local stations put pressure on ABC after Carr said the Kimmel situation could be handled the easy way or the hard way.
FADEL: Is Carr doing the president's bidding here?
KEITH: Certainly, they are fully aligned, and Trump is thrilled with the results. The president has been publicly campaigning against Kimmel for months for his scathing criticisms of Trump and bad ratings, he says. On Air Force One, Trump was asked whether he wanted the FCC chairman to go after other late-night hosts he doesn't like, and Trump broadened it out even further, saying the networks are too negative about him.
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PRESIDENT DONALD TRUMP: If they're 97% against, they give me only bad publicity or press. I mean, if they're getting a license, I would think maybe their license should be taken away. It'll be up to Brendan Carr. I think Brendan Carr is outstanding. He's a patriot, he loves our country and he's a tough guy.
FADEL: I mean, Tam, I mean, how does that square with First Amendment protections for free speech and a free press?
KEITH: Advocates and scholars are raising alarms. Already, this administration has been sued by law firms and universities for various actions they say are using the power of the government to punish them for speech. And earlier this week, Attorney General Pam Bondi said hate speech isn't free speech, which made a lot of conservatives uncomfortable. She walked it back. Ilya Somin is a constitutional law expert at the libertarian Cato Institute, and he told me government power is very obviously being weaponized against speech.
ILYA SOMIN: There are some legal and political issues that are complicated and difficult. Here, sort of the bald-faced nature of what the administration is doing is not difficult at all. And therefore, I want to be clear and unequivocal about it.
KEITH: Somin told me the First Amendment doesn't guarantee you a job, but it does prevent the government from trying to get you fired for something you've said.
FADEL: I mean, what does the Trump administration say to this very real alarm that they're wielding government power to silence people?
KEITH: The White House says, quote, "free speech is alive and well." But there are many examples of Trump and his administration using the power they have to go after the media. Trump has filed lawsuits against ABC and CBS, which settled. There are suits against The New York Times and Wall Street Journal, which they are fighting, and that barely scratches the surface. In the first term, he complained about his coverage. This time, he is actively working to change it.
FADEL: NPR's Tamara Keith. Thank you, Tam.
KEITH: You're welcome. Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright NPR.
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